If she looked down on people we’d have noticed by now. So…no need to tell her to stop as if that’s an ingrained character problem.

And besides, we’re hoping to promote respectful dialog around here so please share your constructive criticism as respectfully as possible.

April-

Part of me was trolling, part of me was serious. Both the High church types, and the unchurched types (me) have some haughtiness/issues vs. one another. It IS rude, in the absence of a “please feel free to post,” to post…and act entitled to it.

Stop looking down on folks cultured in a church. Human relationships are fragile.

Since you cant see “trust” via email this ends up looking like a standoff of sorts. I “trust” April because when no one is looking she serves. She connects with people consistently that I find annoying.I admire her faith and her faithfulness.

She is gracious to those of us who are often “out there” in our theological views. She has extended “trust” when she didnt even know if we would notice>

Well, I have noticed and so when she tells me the story about her eperience with the Christian Bookstore – I listen and believe her.

I can do that since I know her track record and as the reigning OA er in out little network she has earned the right to a day off for noticing something other than how someone else is doing.

Thanks April for all you do

And Chris – you are one smart, insightful and genuine person
Thanks for interacting with us here and I hope this won’t be your last time

Chris, no need to feel like you can’t be open about your feelings here. I hope you will check out this site and read more of what I have personally written because I think that you will find that this post isn’t a normal one for me. I think that Helen and Randy, having read many comments from me in the past (I post once a week here), understand that I was just trying to be transparent with my feelings–good or bad.

Being a Christian who is outside the church is difficult sometimes. We have a ministry that we have committed to and it is alive and flourishing, but we are often questioned by churches and Christians because we are not supported by any specific denomination. That’s why I am sensitive to it. In fact, once we were singing for a specific church and they actually announced that we were with their denomination so that they could “legitimize” us to their congregation after several people questioned what denomination we were with.

We don’t collect money or charge for our ministry and don’t expect freebies from anyone, either. This is honestly the first time that I have had to advertise since we started our ministry five years ago. Our ministry has always been about giving and not taking, and that’s why I am sorry that the tone of my post came off in such a way. It doesn’t represent what our ministry is really about, and it doesn’t really represent me as a person, either. It simply mirrors some of my frustrations with deailing with Christians as an outsider to the corporate church.

I think if you hang out with us for a while, you will find us to be open to receiving whatever you have to say.

I have similar frustration about the public Christian, which I believe I alluded to above somewhere (while missing your point, I might add). I just didn’t get the impression that April was in that category, but I can see now why you might have. Thanks for taking the time to explain yourself here.

It really does matter if we fail to listen to one another. I’m working on that.

I don’t think I was harsh–someone who OWNS a bookstore should get asked. It’s BASELINE manners, unless the bulletin board EXPLICITLY says, “post whatever the hell you want here.”

Chris, like someone else here said, I’ve seen bulletin boards where people can post whatever they want – it think it varies from store to store. I agree that it’s best not to assume things. But it feels to me like the store owner made a ton of assumptions about April. If April shouldn’t have assumed, the store owner shouldn’t have either, right? Can we say they both made mistakes?

The general Christian (to whom much has been given) has such horrible comportment in the world, and is so militantly thoughtless that it’s no wonder there are stiff barriers to evangalism.

Absolutely.

I was shocked to see the tenor and tone of this post, and yeah, we’re all sinners, but to be on a blog about CONNECTING with people, and to have commandeered their reaources presumably without permission…and then get mad at THEM when they ultimately let your rudeness go…just made my head blow up.

We encourage people to be honest here (as long as they can do it and be respectful of each other) and it seems to me April was being honest rather than saying “My behavior was perfect!”

Based on experience, my sense is that April is very open to us saying “Maybe you could have behaved differently”.

I think maybe you erred in assuming April and others here were affirming presumptuousness and thoughtlessness. That never was my intention and I doubt it was April’s either. What gets really tiring is always having to be the one who shows grace – because if we slip up once there’s no grace for us…

And maybe you’re feeling that no grace has been shown to you here – if so I’m sorry, because we do intend to welcome everyone and not have a knee-jerk negative reaction against people who happen not to agree with us. Thanks for sharing – you’ve made this comments discussion much more interesting than it would have been had you not contributed – please stick around unless you are so annoyed with us you can’t stand to be here anymore

I wasn’t a “Churched” christian–and April’s right to hold Christians to a higher standard. What april did was the equivalent of comment spam–if I wanted to drive traffic from OA sites to mine…and then act mad about it when someone said something.

I’m a mortgage lender–if I had posted “chrisdoes loans .com ” all over this place, it would be rude; yet Christian Business network people make lunatic presumptions all the time.

I don’t think I was harsh–someone who OWNS a bookstore should get asked. It’s BASELINE manners, unless the bulletin board EXPLICITLY says, “post whatever the hell you want here.”

It’s equally astonishing that you feel like someone was haughty, or overstepping their bounds to choose to let a post remain or not remain.

In public, the presumption over other’s resources is the biggest turn off about Christians.

—> Christians are not welcomed at resaraunts like the Olive Garden because they monopolize server’s tables, and leave substandard tips…while moralizing that those people shouldn’t be working on a Sunday.

—> In real estate, it’s said that the surest way to know you’re getting screwed is by the number of times someone brings out Christ. (I agree, and it breaks my heart).

—> And then there are the pious; those that believe that works/not grace is the basis of their salvation; and cluck at someone who has a difference of opinion from theirs.

The general Christian (to whom much has been given) has such horrible comportment in the world, and is so militantly thoughtless that it’s no wonder there are stiff barriers to evangalism.

I was shocked to see the tenor and tone of this post, and yeah, we’re all sinners, but to be on a blog about CONNECTING with people, and to have commandeered their reaources presumably without permission…and then get mad at THEM when they ultimately let your rudeness go…just made my head blow up.

Anyway, this’ll be it–I’ll leave you folks to cluck over me and my harsh ways. If y’all decide I’m without merit

It’s not. This site is about learning how to celebrate the ordinary attempt. We do that by telling stories, and by sometimes sharing a thought about evangelism or what it means to be ordinary. It’s partly about education, partly about celebration, and partly about getting people to think about how we connect with others. It seems like April did a pretty good job at that this week!

I would argue that humans are self-aggrandizing, self-important idiots. That seems to be a human condition and not uniquely Christian.

Amen to that, sister! Hard to say it outloud without becoming a poster child for the point, though, eh? (been there, done that, got the t-shirt). I used to say that church would be a lot of fun if it wasn’t for all the idiots that keep showing up.

Yeah…I know, I ARE one.

Chris, I wasn’t sure what you were saying, but it did sound a bit harsh (which it seems April also felt). I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, which is not something I am naturally good at. Can you help me understand a bit more of what your intent was here? I might have missed your point entirely.